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	<title>Comments on: MDs and ESQs: &#8220;I don&#8217;t get no respect&#8221;</title>
	<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/</link>
	<description>Practical Career Advice for Women Who Think Outside the Cube</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 20:13:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: Will</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-25026</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 03:16:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-25026</guid>
					<description>When it all boils down to it, both career paths require dedication, crazy hours and most of the time giving up a piece of your life. The only difference is that for MD and ESQ's they have some sort of reassurance that their time invested will be some what rewarded in the end, can't always say that for the next aspiring web 2.0 entrepreneur millionaire.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When it all boils down to it, both career paths require dedication, crazy hours and most of the time giving up a piece of your life. The only difference is that for MD and ESQ&#8217;s they have some sort of reassurance that their time invested will be some what rewarded in the end, can&#8217;t always say that for the next aspiring web 2.0 entrepreneur millionaire.
</p>
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		<title>by: Michelle Goodman</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-25025</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 02:41:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-25025</guid>
					<description>hi, amy w and everyone else who wrote in:

(a) i am sorry i was cranky yesterday. errr, and monday. i'm chalking it up to sleep deprivation and deadline stress, but you can chalk it up to whatever you like. :) this posting experience has taught me yet another a valuable blogging lesson: you never know who might be reading your book/blog, so think long-and-hard before you risk offending vast swaths of potential readers. that said, i gotta be me and say what i feel... (also, i smell a blog post coming on re the practiced polish of a book and the off-the-cuff rawness of a blog, but that's another can of worms for another day.)

(b) THAT SAID, i had NO idea that anti 9-5 lawyers would read my book. or this blog. that is so cool. in fact, when i wrote the book, i had no idea ANYONE AT ALL would read it (aside from my editor and friends and family), so it's lovely to get positive feedback on both efforts. thank you. thank you. THANK YOU. i am glad it's been helpful.

(c) when i wrote the initial post in question, i was mostly scoffing at the 50something/60something lawyers/doctors i've met along the way (my parents' contemporaries) who i've heard complain about things i think they have no business complaining about. you know, people with too many cars or rooms in their houses who whine about their workaholic lives. (these are the very people who gave me grief about my chosen profession when i was young and could have used the emotional support of some older folks in my life. i moved 3K miles away to get away from this culture. but i guess i still have a chip, eh?) those folks in question likely have the means to change gears if they need to, even if it means selling off some assets. i was not at all intending to bash anti 9-5/creative/do-gooder lawyers with flex gigs, PT gigs, grassroots gigs, novels in progress, etc. those are the people i relate to and wrote the book for... anyway, i'm sure everyone will have more to say about all this, and you're welcome to. as long as it's not pornographic, i'll send the comments through. but i'm moving on, except to say this:

(d) i think barack is pretty fab too. if he gets the nom, i'm with him 110%. but first, i'm gunning for hil. she won me over this month.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hi, amy w and everyone else who wrote in:</p>
<p>(a) i am sorry i was cranky yesterday. errr, and monday. i&#8217;m chalking it up to sleep deprivation and deadline stress, but you can chalk it up to whatever you like. <img src='http://www.anti9to5guide.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  this posting experience has taught me yet another a valuable blogging lesson: you never know who might be reading your book/blog, so think long-and-hard before you risk offending vast swaths of potential readers. that said, i gotta be me and say what i feel&#8230; (also, i smell a blog post coming on re the practiced polish of a book and the off-the-cuff rawness of a blog, but that&#8217;s another can of worms for another day.)</p>
<p>(b) THAT SAID, i had NO idea that anti 9-5 lawyers would read my book. or this blog. that is so cool. in fact, when i wrote the book, i had no idea ANYONE AT ALL would read it (aside from my editor and friends and family), so it&#8217;s lovely to get positive feedback on both efforts. thank you. thank you. THANK YOU. i am glad it&#8217;s been helpful.</p>
<p>(c) when i wrote the initial post in question, i was mostly scoffing at the 50something/60something lawyers/doctors i&#8217;ve met along the way (my parents&#8217; contemporaries) who i&#8217;ve heard complain about things i think they have no business complaining about. you know, people with too many cars or rooms in their houses who whine about their workaholic lives. (these are the very people who gave me grief about my chosen profession when i was young and could have used the emotional support of some older folks in my life. i moved 3K miles away to get away from this culture. but i guess i still have a chip, eh?) those folks in question likely have the means to change gears if they need to, even if it means selling off some assets. i was not at all intending to bash anti 9-5/creative/do-gooder lawyers with flex gigs, PT gigs, grassroots gigs, novels in progress, etc. those are the people i relate to and wrote the book for&#8230; anyway, i&#8217;m sure everyone will have more to say about all this, and you&#8217;re welcome to. as long as it&#8217;s not pornographic, i&#8217;ll send the comments through. but i&#8217;m moving on, except to say this:</p>
<p>(d) i think barack is pretty fab too. if he gets the nom, i&#8217;m with him 110%. but first, i&#8217;m gunning for hil. she won me over this month.
</p>
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		<title>by: Amy Williams</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-25007</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 18:02:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-25007</guid>
					<description>Michelle,

I just wanted to say that, although I was a little turned off by this post, I still LOVE your book. It's my new "how-to" manual for making a living as a part-time environmental lawyer, part-time Starbucks barista! :) And your blog is really great, too.

And, although I'm more of an Obama fan, I also really love Hillary. She's awesome.

Love,
Amy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michelle,</p>
<p>I just wanted to say that, although I was a little turned off by this post, I still LOVE your book. It&#8217;s my new &#8220;how-to&#8221; manual for making a living as a part-time environmental lawyer, part-time Starbucks barista! <img src='http://www.anti9to5guide.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  And your blog is really great, too.</p>
<p>And, although I&#8217;m more of an Obama fan, I also really love Hillary. She&#8217;s awesome.</p>
<p>Love,<br />
Amy
</p>
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		<title>by: Michelle Goodman</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24979</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 06:53:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24979</guid>
					<description>oy vey. 

i, too, work in a field that the average person does not understand. that is why this nytimes article tickled me so (btw, the article, if you read it, DID point out the hardships of law grads today). 

i understand that the lawyers are pissed off. i am contemplating shutting down the comments. of course, i am holding out hope that hillary clinton, my absolute favorite female lawyer (i'm totally serious -- i'm rooting for her in a big way), will chime in about how she's offended too. somehow i think she has better things to do though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>oy vey. </p>
<p>i, too, work in a field that the average person does not understand. that is why this nytimes article tickled me so (btw, the article, if you read it, DID point out the hardships of law grads today). </p>
<p>i understand that the lawyers are pissed off. i am contemplating shutting down the comments. of course, i am holding out hope that hillary clinton, my absolute favorite female lawyer (i&#8217;m totally serious &#8212; i&#8217;m rooting for her in a big way), will chime in about how she&#8217;s offended too. somehow i think she has better things to do though.
</p>
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		<title>by: Anali</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24976</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 06:20:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24976</guid>
					<description>Another attorney here just piping in.  In reality, many attorneys are making far less money than six figures and can barely pay their student loans.  This is something that your average person doesn't understand.  There are not enough jobs out there and those jobs that are mentioned in the article are few and far between.  Here are some more articles that give a more realistic view. 

http://dealbook.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/09/24/trying-times-for-law-students/

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB119040786780835602.html?dlbk

Many of us are doing contract work and don't have benefits.  I have a flexible schedule, which allows me to pursue my writing on the side, which is great, but it's hard trying to explain to people the reality.  There are many attorneys struggling to make a living just live everyone else.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another attorney here just piping in.  In reality, many attorneys are making far less money than six figures and can barely pay their student loans.  This is something that your average person doesn&#8217;t understand.  There are not enough jobs out there and those jobs that are mentioned in the article are few and far between.  Here are some more articles that give a more realistic view. </p>
<p><a href='http://dealbook.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/09/24/trying-times-for-law-students/' rel='nofollow'>http://dealbook.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/09/24/trying-times-for-law-students/</a></p>
<p><a href='http://online.wsj.com/article/SB119040786780835602.html?dlbk' rel='nofollow'>http://online.wsj.com/article/SB119040786780835602.html?dlbk</a></p>
<p>Many of us are doing contract work and don&#8217;t have benefits.  I have a flexible schedule, which allows me to pursue my writing on the side, which is great, but it&#8217;s hard trying to explain to people the reality.  There are many attorneys struggling to make a living just live everyone else.
</p>
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		<title>by: Amy Williams</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24961</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 18:43:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24961</guid>
					<description>Like, the first commenter, I also took some offense to this entry. Not all doctors and lawyers are evil. Or chained to their desks. In fact, I am a freelance environmental lawyer. I use my JD (which I am so, so glad I got), I save trees, and I work in my PJs. The best of all worlds!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Like, the first commenter, I also took some offense to this entry. Not all doctors and lawyers are evil. Or chained to their desks. In fact, I am a freelance environmental lawyer. I use my JD (which I am so, so glad I got), I save trees, and I work in my PJs. The best of all worlds!
</p>
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		<title>by: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24925</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 00:01:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24925</guid>
					<description>Thats ok MD's and JD's   I am a dentist..went to school as long as the MD's..longer than the JD's, did post grad residency etc etc ..and this author put me on the same level as an accountant.Last time I checked my field was still a profession.  Anyway status is a bunch of crap....one should do their job well, be nice to people, and be happy with themselves....that is where job satisfaction comes from!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thats ok MD&#8217;s and JD&#8217;s   I am a dentist..went to school as long as the MD&#8217;s..longer than the JD&#8217;s, did post grad residency etc etc ..and this author put me on the same level as an accountant.Last time I checked my field was still a profession.  Anyway status is a bunch of crap&#8230;.one should do their job well, be nice to people, and be happy with themselves&#8230;.that is where job satisfaction comes from!
</p>
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		<title>by: Lauren</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24921</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 22:53:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24921</guid>
					<description>As someone who got her law degree, worked in the legal field for a year, then promptly got the hell out in favor of a full-time job at the arts nonprofit where I interned in college, I really appreciated this entry.

(BTW, Michelle, I LOVE your book, read it religiously during my career change, and recommend it to everyone I know.  I've also given it as a gift at least twice.)

I, too, know fantastic attorneys who are both ethical and good at what they do.  I also know full-of-themselves pricks who were incredibly petty to a boho theatre major like me during law school, because their sheltered little minds couldn't handle anyone "different."  See why I was so eager to get out of law?

I don't regret getting my JD--I feel like it really improved my writing and problem-solving skills, which are useful in any profession (and when you are trying to keep yourself fed and housed during your career change!).  That said, I do agree with the MD-Esq dynamic due being held up as the Holy Grail of careers, and that can really lead people who aren't quite sure what to do with their lives after college (heaven forbid!) into a path that ultimately isn't right for them.

So that's my two cents.  Keep on rockin'!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone who got her law degree, worked in the legal field for a year, then promptly got the hell out in favor of a full-time job at the arts nonprofit where I interned in college, I really appreciated this entry.</p>
<p>(BTW, Michelle, I LOVE your book, read it religiously during my career change, and recommend it to everyone I know.  I&#8217;ve also given it as a gift at least twice.)</p>
<p>I, too, know fantastic attorneys who are both ethical and good at what they do.  I also know full-of-themselves pricks who were incredibly petty to a boho theatre major like me during law school, because their sheltered little minds couldn&#8217;t handle anyone &#8220;different.&#8221;  See why I was so eager to get out of law?</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t regret getting my JD&#8211;I feel like it really improved my writing and problem-solving skills, which are useful in any profession (and when you are trying to keep yourself fed and housed during your career change!).  That said, I do agree with the MD-Esq dynamic due being held up as the Holy Grail of careers, and that can really lead people who aren&#8217;t quite sure what to do with their lives after college (heaven forbid!) into a path that ultimately isn&#8217;t right for them.</p>
<p>So that&#8217;s my two cents.  Keep on rockin&#8217;!
</p>
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		<title>by: Michelle Goodman</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24900</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 15:13:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24900</guid>
					<description>my dad is a lawyer, my uncle is a doctor, and i have a couple of doctor or lawyer friends. some of them are happy with their work, some of them are not. some of them are smug about their vocation, some are not. some of the happiest of the bunch work in the least lucrative and most "helpful" gigs (medical clinics, nonprofit/policy work, public defenders, etc).

even though the Sunday Style section is often fluffy bunk (note how the article i'm referencing paints most doctors/lawyers as lamenting that the work just ain't what it used to be), this article made me smile. and i wanted to share why. call it my revenge of the freelance nerds moment. (maybe you had to grow up in the tri-state area in the 80s...)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>my dad is a lawyer, my uncle is a doctor, and i have a couple of doctor or lawyer friends. some of them are happy with their work, some of them are not. some of them are smug about their vocation, some are not. some of the happiest of the bunch work in the least lucrative and most &#8220;helpful&#8221; gigs (medical clinics, nonprofit/policy work, public defenders, etc).</p>
<p>even though the Sunday Style section is often fluffy bunk (note how the article i&#8217;m referencing paints most doctors/lawyers as lamenting that the work just ain&#8217;t what it used to be), this article made me smile. and i wanted to share why. call it my revenge of the freelance nerds moment. (maybe you had to grow up in the tri-state area in the 80s&#8230;)
</p>
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		<title>by: Kuri</title>
		<link>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24897</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 14:47:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.anti9to5guide.com/2008/01/07/mds-and-esqs-i-dont-get-no-respect/#comment-24897</guid>
					<description>I feel a bit sorry for the doctors and lawyers, actually. Not the callous careerist (there are a few of those) but for the ones who went into these professions thinking that they are important and expecting to do important things, only to become disillusioned by the "billable hours" nature of the profession. They have a lot of student debt, making a late career change a bit difficult. While I don't know any doctors well, I understand this is particularly true for doctors who want to be general practioners but find that a specialist practise that charges high fees is the only way to pay off the debt.

That said, I think the careerists (those who choose the profession of doctor or lawyer because it's prestigious or money-making) are hurting these careers a lot. They're the ones driving up tuition and learning to do well on exams rather than out any passion or appreciate of the subjects. And they're probably infecting their idealist co-workers with regular, unhealthy doses of cynicism. As someone who has thought a lot about a legal career it's this aspect of the career that's putting me off.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel a bit sorry for the doctors and lawyers, actually. Not the callous careerist (there are a few of those) but for the ones who went into these professions thinking that they are important and expecting to do important things, only to become disillusioned by the &#8220;billable hours&#8221; nature of the profession. They have a lot of student debt, making a late career change a bit difficult. While I don&#8217;t know any doctors well, I understand this is particularly true for doctors who want to be general practioners but find that a specialist practise that charges high fees is the only way to pay off the debt.</p>
<p>That said, I think the careerists (those who choose the profession of doctor or lawyer because it&#8217;s prestigious or money-making) are hurting these careers a lot. They&#8217;re the ones driving up tuition and learning to do well on exams rather than out any passion or appreciate of the subjects. And they&#8217;re probably infecting their idealist co-workers with regular, unhealthy doses of cynicism. As someone who has thought a lot about a legal career it&#8217;s this aspect of the career that&#8217;s putting me off.
</p>
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